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The Bible on:

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Trinitarian Challenge

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This section is dedicated to Pastors and Preachers, male or female, papers or not. They are from different Churches and orginizations but the same Faith. If I disagree with a small point I will make the appropriate comment and offer the minister opportunity to reply.

This was a post to an E-mail forum that I am on. I thought it belonged here. The author, Pastor Joe Jarvis of the Pentecostal Assemblies of the World agreed. The title is my addition.

Trinitarians on the Trinity

It is difficult for me to understand how anyone can call us *(Apostolic Pentecostals) a cult for our views on the "Trinity", and subsequently, Baptism in Jesus' name.

If they would take a look at what their "scholars" have to say on these subjects, they might be surprised.

The "Scholar" exerpts are from the: International Standard Bible Encyclopedia:

The term "Trinity" is not a Biblical term, and we are not using Biblical language when we define what is expressed by it as the doctrine that there is one only and true God, but in the unity of the Godhead there are three coeternal and coequal Persons, the same.

Pastor Joe:
The term "Trinity" is not Biblical.

And the definition of a Biblical doctrine in such un-Biblical language can be justified only on the principle that it is better to preserve the truth of Scripture than the words of Scripture.

Pastor Joe:
The words of the Scripture do not say what they mean.

....(the doctrine of the Trinity) ...embodies a truth which has never been discovered, and is indiscoverable, by natural reason.

Pastor Joe:
This doctrine cannot be understood.

Triads of divinities, no doubt, occur in nearly all polytheistic religions,

Pastor Joe:
Polytheism... their word, not mine.


New Testament Usage: But the New Testament itself makes the whole matter perfectly plain. The uniform meaning of "dip" for baptizo and the use of the river Jordan as the place for baptizing by John the Baptist makes inevitable the notion of immersion unless there is some direct contradictory testimony.

Pastor Joe:
Baptism by immersion only.
*(I add that there is no direct contradictory testimony ;-)

The Formula of Baptism.-- The Formula of Christian baptism, in the mode which prevailed, is given in Mt 28:19: "I baptize thee in the name of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost." But it is curious that the words are not given in any description of Christian baptism until the time of Justin Martyr: and there they are not repeated exactly but in a slightly extended and explanatory form.

Pastor Joe:
"Father, Son, and Holy Ghost not used in baptism, until..."

In every account of the performance of the rite in apostolic times a much shorter formula is in use. The 3,000 believers were baptized on the Day of Pentecost "in the name of Jesus"Acts 2:38; and the same formula was used at the baptism of Cornelius and those that were with him Acts 10:48.

Pastor Joe:
This is certainly not news to any of us *(Apostolics, that is)

Jesus Christ was Lord. Scholars have exercised a great deal of ingenuity in trying to explain how, with what appear to be the very words of Jesus given in the Gospel of Mt, another and much shorter formula seems to have been used throughout the apostolic church.

Pastor Joe:
Ingenious: skilled in inventing new ideas.

Tertullian, nearly half a century later, declares expressly that the "law of baptism has been imposed and the formula prescribed" in Mt 28:19 (De Bapt., 13); and he adds in his Adversus Praxean (c. 26): "And it is not once only, but thrice, that we are immersed into the Three Persons, at each several mention of Their names."

Pastor Joe:
Their names?

....collections of ecclesiastical canons (Apos. Canons, 43, 50), prove that the practice of using the shorter formula existed in the 5th and 6th centuries, at all events in the East. "Shorter formula = Baptism in Jesus' name"

Pastor Joe:
I have used the Bible Encyclopedia to explain to those who claim we are so far wrong, so that they can pay attention to what *they* have actually said regarding these heretical beliefs. Here is what has been said by this scholar:

"The term "Trinity" is not Biblical.

The words of the Scripture do not say what they mean. (If you are to believe the doctrine of the Trinity.)

This doctrine cannot be understood

Triads of divinities...occur in...polytheistic religions

Baptism by immersion in the name of Jesus Christ only.

I baptize thee in the name of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost...not given in any description of Christian baptism until the time of Justin Martyr.

In every account...believers were baptized..."in the name of Jesus"

Must be "Ingenious: skilled in inventing new ideas"... to explain away Acts 2:38-39,etc

Three Persons...Their names (Matt 28:19: one name)

For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned. Matt 12:37

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If you have any questions at all write me!


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